BBC新闻:Type 45驱逐舰-英国10亿镑战舰面临引擎整修

来源:百度文库 编辑:超级军网 时间:2024/04/27 19:01:19


核心提示:

Type 45驱逐舰的全电力推进系统在服役期间故障频仍,情况在同型舰里都有发生。虽然看起来还不立刻导致这些战舰趴窝而完全不能值勤,然而
经常出状况的电力/推进系统却危及了这型军舰在值勤与可能实战下的生存性。文中没有明确指出全电推进系统的主要问题出自特定部位,多次提到
柴油发电机故障,但革命性的WR21燃气涡轮或整个全电力系统架构其他节点都可能是发生问题的点。处理不够可靠的全电推进系统成为当务之急,
因为皇家海军的舰队兵力已经很吃紧。维护状况频出的全电系统增加了皇家海军的开支,而到了2019年Type 45开始陆续面临中期大修时,可能
会牵涉到更换柴油发电机的大工程。



本人2012年4月4日在朴次茅兹出海口拍摄Type 45驱逐舰不屈号(HMS Dauntless D33)出海开始六个月的大西洋方面长期部署。

后来得知,不屈号在这趟部署中发生多次电力故障。



新闻连结:

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-35432341

Type 45 destroyers: UK's £1bn warships face engine refit:

The Royal Navy's most modern warships are to be fitted with new engines because they keep breaking down.


In an email seen by the BBC, a serving Royal Navy officer wrote that "total electric failures are common" on its fleet of six £1bn Type 45 destroyers.

BBC公开一封皇家海军军官投书的信:每艘价值10亿英镑的Type 45导弹驱逐舰,「全电力推进系统故障频仍」

The Ministry of Defence said there were reliability issues with the propulsion system and work to fix it would be done to ensure "ships remain available".

英国防卫大臣表示,这些战舰的推进系统存在可靠性问题,会对其进行修正工作,使这些船舰能正常值勤。

One Royal Navy officer said the cost could reach tens of millions of pounds.

一位皇家海军军官表示,这些工作(修正推进系统)可能耗费上千万英镑

In a statement, the MoD told the BBC that to "address some reliability issues" it was considering options to "upgrade the ships' diesel generators to add greater resilience to the power and the propulsion system".

英国国防部对BBC透露,关于可靠度问题,可能的选项包括升级舰上的柴油发电机,使整个全电推进系统更可靠

That will involve significant work, though the Royal Navy insists that the six destroyers will still be deployed all over the world.

这些牵涉到可观的改进工作。不过皇家海军坚持,这六艘Type 45驱逐舰目前仍然可以正常进行全球部署

'Major weak link'

But from 2019 each will begin to undergo a major refit that will probably involve cutting a large hole to insert at least one new generator into the ship.

然而,到2019年Type 45驱逐舰队要陆续面临寿命中期大修时,可能会船舰增加至少一具新发电机,为此要在舰体开个大洞,工作量可观。

The work will be staggered to ensure the Navy still has ships to send on operations.

这些工程的排程会确保皇家海军仍然有足够的Type 45驱逐舰能派遣值勤。

The MoD would not give any details on cost.

目前国防部没有提供改善工程的细节花费资料

Admiral Lord West, a former First Sea Lord, said the development was "very worrying" and the MoD must have known "three or four years ago" that the destroyers had problems.
The ex-Labour security minister said any delay in rectifying the problem would leave the Navy's surface fleet badly stretched, as the Navy can already "only just do some of the tasks we should be doing around the world".
"What I would hope is there is already in place a 'get well' programme and we must move very quickly to rectify these problems," he said.
Grey line

前第一海相罗德.维斯特上将(Adm. Lord West)表示情况的发展「非常让人担心」,国防部显然早在三到四年前就已经知道这些驱逐舰有问题。
前工党防卫秘书表示,任何对于修复工作的延迟,都会使皇家海军现役水面舰队吃紧情况更加严重,皇家海军已经缩减了过去向来执行的全球勤务。
「我希望相关当局已经准备好一些维护(get well)计画,而且必须非常快速地执行来解决问题」

'The lights went out'
HMS DauntlessImage copyrightPA
I experienced one of the many power outages on board HMS Dauntless, off the coast of Senegal, in 2012.

Type 45驱逐舰不屈号的人员:「在2012年的部署勤务,在赛内加尔外海经历过许多断电情况」

Suddenly all the lights on the ship went out. It was quickly fixed but it appears to be a problem that has plagued the entire fleet.

突然之间,舰上的灯光都熄灭了。虽然断电情况可以快速恢复,但这类情况在整个Type 45舰队里越来越常见。

In 2014 Dauntless had to abandon a training exercise and, in 2009, HMS Daring lost power in the Atlantic on her first voyage to the US. She suffered more propulsion problems off Kuwait in 2012.

在2014年,不屈号曾因为电力状况而被迫放弃演习勤务。在2009年,Type 45的勇敢号(HMS Daring D32)在前往美国的航程中于大西洋上发生断电;而勇敢号在2012年中东部署勤务中,在科威特遭遇过多次推进系统故障。

Initially the MoD dismissed these electrical failures as "teething problems".

一开始,国防部对这类电力故障的消息一律用「新舰磨合」之类的回应打发掉。

But it has now admitted that there is a bigger problem - one that could be disastrous for a ship and her crew in combat.

然而到现在情况以经日益明显,这是个大问题,在战场上会折损整条战舰跟人员

Nick Childs, of the International Institute for Strategic Studies, said: "It's an unfortunate extra cost the Royal Navy will have to swallow to sort out an unreliable propulsion system - the major weak link in an otherwise world-beating system.

国际战略研究机构的研究员Nick Childs表示:「很不幸地,对于这些不可靠的推进系统,皇家海军必须吞下这些额外的维护成本」

"They're essentially going to have to squeeze in an extra generator to improve reliability."

「基本上,他们准备挤进一部额外发电机来改善可靠性」

The warning signs were there in 2009 when the Commons Defence Committee published its report on the Type 45.

在2009年,下议院国防委员会(the Commons Defence Committee)公开关于Type 45的报告,首次露出警讯

MPs noted "persistent over-optimism and underestimation of the technical challenges, combined with inappropriate commercial arrangements" leading to rising costs.

当时国会议员表示:「过于乐观的态度加上低估技术挑战性,加上不当的商业规划,增加了此型船舰运作的成本。」

Each destroyer ended up costing about £1bn. The Royal Navy wanted 12 ships but ended up with half that number.

每艘Type 45驱逐舰的成本最后超过10亿英镑,皇家海军最初希望建造12艘,最后落得只建造半数的下场。

The Type 45 has an integrated electric propulsion system that powers everything on board.

Type 44拥有集成电力推进系统,为舰上所有装备与推进提供动力。


The problem won't be solved quickly and it is likely to put a strain on the Royal Navy, which has already shrunk considerably in size.

「这些问题很难轻易地被解决,而这很可能会对于舰队规模以经显著缩水的皇家海军,无疑会造成更多压力」

It is now down to a surface fleet of 19 frigates and destroyers.

现在皇家海军只剩19艘驱逐舰/护卫舰现役

A spokesman for Rolls-Royce, which makes the WR-21 marine gas turbine used on the warships, said the company continued to work with the MoD on upgrading the performance of the propulsion system.

为Type 45提供WR21燃气涡轮的Rolls-Royce的发言人表示,该公司持续努力与皇家海军合作,改善这些驱逐舰的服勤表现。

BAE Systems, the company which builds the warships, said in a statement that the destroyers were "among the world's most capable air defence destroyer".

建造Type 45驱逐舰的BAE System表示,这些驱逐舰是全世界上能力最强大的防空驱逐舰。

It said it was working with the MoD "to deliver improvements to the power generation capability of the Type 45 destroyers".

BAE与国防部继续合作,继续完善Type 45驱逐舰的整合电力推进系统

核心提示:

Type 45驱逐舰的全电力推进系统在服役期间故障频仍,情况在同型舰里都有发生。虽然看起来还不立刻导致这些战舰趴窝而完全不能值勤,然而
经常出状况的电力/推进系统却危及了这型军舰在值勤与可能实战下的生存性。文中没有明确指出全电推进系统的主要问题出自特定部位,多次提到
柴油发电机故障,但革命性的WR21燃气涡轮或整个全电力系统架构其他节点都可能是发生问题的点。处理不够可靠的全电推进系统成为当务之急,
因为皇家海军的舰队兵力已经很吃紧。维护状况频出的全电系统增加了皇家海军的开支,而到了2019年Type 45开始陆续面临中期大修时,可能
会牵涉到更换柴油发电机的大工程。

232132c3f8e8rcvrygghy8.jpg (450.51 KB, 下载次数: 111)

下载附件 保存到相册

2016-1-29 17:59 上传



本人2012年4月4日在朴次茅兹出海口拍摄Type 45驱逐舰不屈号(HMS Dauntless D33)出海开始六个月的大西洋方面长期部署。

后来得知,不屈号在这趟部署中发生多次电力故障。

232138pcii6cq8hbzoxiox.jpg (357.02 KB, 下载次数: 108)

下载附件 保存到相册

2016-1-29 17:59 上传



新闻连结:

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-35432341

Type 45 destroyers: UK's £1bn warships face engine refit:

The Royal Navy's most modern warships are to be fitted with new engines because they keep breaking down.


In an email seen by the BBC, a serving Royal Navy officer wrote that "total electric failures are common" on its fleet of six £1bn Type 45 destroyers.

BBC公开一封皇家海军军官投书的信:每艘价值10亿英镑的Type 45导弹驱逐舰,「全电力推进系统故障频仍」

The Ministry of Defence said there were reliability issues with the propulsion system and work to fix it would be done to ensure "ships remain available".

英国防卫大臣表示,这些战舰的推进系统存在可靠性问题,会对其进行修正工作,使这些船舰能正常值勤。

One Royal Navy officer said the cost could reach tens of millions of pounds.

一位皇家海军军官表示,这些工作(修正推进系统)可能耗费上千万英镑

In a statement, the MoD told the BBC that to "address some reliability issues" it was considering options to "upgrade the ships' diesel generators to add greater resilience to the power and the propulsion system".

英国国防部对BBC透露,关于可靠度问题,可能的选项包括升级舰上的柴油发电机,使整个全电推进系统更可靠

That will involve significant work, though the Royal Navy insists that the six destroyers will still be deployed all over the world.

这些牵涉到可观的改进工作。不过皇家海军坚持,这六艘Type 45驱逐舰目前仍然可以正常进行全球部署

'Major weak link'

But from 2019 each will begin to undergo a major refit that will probably involve cutting a large hole to insert at least one new generator into the ship.

然而,到2019年Type 45驱逐舰队要陆续面临寿命中期大修时,可能会船舰增加至少一具新发电机,为此要在舰体开个大洞,工作量可观。

The work will be staggered to ensure the Navy still has ships to send on operations.

这些工程的排程会确保皇家海军仍然有足够的Type 45驱逐舰能派遣值勤。

The MoD would not give any details on cost.

目前国防部没有提供改善工程的细节花费资料

Admiral Lord West, a former First Sea Lord, said the development was "very worrying" and the MoD must have known "three or four years ago" that the destroyers had problems.
The ex-Labour security minister said any delay in rectifying the problem would leave the Navy's surface fleet badly stretched, as the Navy can already "only just do some of the tasks we should be doing around the world".
"What I would hope is there is already in place a 'get well' programme and we must move very quickly to rectify these problems," he said.
Grey line

前第一海相罗德.维斯特上将(Adm. Lord West)表示情况的发展「非常让人担心」,国防部显然早在三到四年前就已经知道这些驱逐舰有问题。
前工党防卫秘书表示,任何对于修复工作的延迟,都会使皇家海军现役水面舰队吃紧情况更加严重,皇家海军已经缩减了过去向来执行的全球勤务。
「我希望相关当局已经准备好一些维护(get well)计画,而且必须非常快速地执行来解决问题」

'The lights went out'
HMS DauntlessImage copyrightPA
I experienced one of the many power outages on board HMS Dauntless, off the coast of Senegal, in 2012.

Type 45驱逐舰不屈号的人员:「在2012年的部署勤务,在赛内加尔外海经历过许多断电情况」

Suddenly all the lights on the ship went out. It was quickly fixed but it appears to be a problem that has plagued the entire fleet.

突然之间,舰上的灯光都熄灭了。虽然断电情况可以快速恢复,但这类情况在整个Type 45舰队里越来越常见。

In 2014 Dauntless had to abandon a training exercise and, in 2009, HMS Daring lost power in the Atlantic on her first voyage to the US. She suffered more propulsion problems off Kuwait in 2012.

在2014年,不屈号曾因为电力状况而被迫放弃演习勤务。在2009年,Type 45的勇敢号(HMS Daring D32)在前往美国的航程中于大西洋上发生断电;而勇敢号在2012年中东部署勤务中,在科威特遭遇过多次推进系统故障。

Initially the MoD dismissed these electrical failures as "teething problems".

一开始,国防部对这类电力故障的消息一律用「新舰磨合」之类的回应打发掉。

But it has now admitted that there is a bigger problem - one that could be disastrous for a ship and her crew in combat.

然而到现在情况以经日益明显,这是个大问题,在战场上会折损整条战舰跟人员

Nick Childs, of the International Institute for Strategic Studies, said: "It's an unfortunate extra cost the Royal Navy will have to swallow to sort out an unreliable propulsion system - the major weak link in an otherwise world-beating system.

国际战略研究机构的研究员Nick Childs表示:「很不幸地,对于这些不可靠的推进系统,皇家海军必须吞下这些额外的维护成本」

"They're essentially going to have to squeeze in an extra generator to improve reliability."

「基本上,他们准备挤进一部额外发电机来改善可靠性」

The warning signs were there in 2009 when the Commons Defence Committee published its report on the Type 45.

在2009年,下议院国防委员会(the Commons Defence Committee)公开关于Type 45的报告,首次露出警讯

MPs noted "persistent over-optimism and underestimation of the technical challenges, combined with inappropriate commercial arrangements" leading to rising costs.

当时国会议员表示:「过于乐观的态度加上低估技术挑战性,加上不当的商业规划,增加了此型船舰运作的成本。」

Each destroyer ended up costing about £1bn. The Royal Navy wanted 12 ships but ended up with half that number.

每艘Type 45驱逐舰的成本最后超过10亿英镑,皇家海军最初希望建造12艘,最后落得只建造半数的下场。

The Type 45 has an integrated electric propulsion system that powers everything on board.

Type 44拥有集成电力推进系统,为舰上所有装备与推进提供动力。


The problem won't be solved quickly and it is likely to put a strain on the Royal Navy, which has already shrunk considerably in size.

「这些问题很难轻易地被解决,而这很可能会对于舰队规模以经显著缩水的皇家海军,无疑会造成更多压力」

It is now down to a surface fleet of 19 frigates and destroyers.

现在皇家海军只剩19艘驱逐舰/护卫舰现役

A spokesman for Rolls-Royce, which makes the WR-21 marine gas turbine used on the warships, said the company continued to work with the MoD on upgrading the performance of the propulsion system.

为Type 45提供WR21燃气涡轮的Rolls-Royce的发言人表示,该公司持续努力与皇家海军合作,改善这些驱逐舰的服勤表现。

BAE Systems, the company which builds the warships, said in a statement that the destroyers were "among the world's most capable air defence destroyer".

建造Type 45驱逐舰的BAE System表示,这些驱逐舰是全世界上能力最强大的防空驱逐舰。

It said it was working with the MoD "to deliver improvements to the power generation capability of the Type 45 destroyers".

BAE与国防部继续合作,继续完善Type 45驱逐舰的整合电力推进系统
全电出问题换柴油发电机组?。。。柴油发电机应该是系统里最成熟的技术了。。。
ruuyy 发表于 2016-1-29 18:36
全电出问题换柴油发电机组?。。。柴油发电机应该是系统里最成熟的技术了。。。
牛牛的柴油机一直不怎么样
这就是打肿脸充胖子的后果,我再说一次驱逐舰级别的IPS军舰成熟得2030年代
DJTesla 发表于 2016-1-29 18:43
牛牛的柴油机一直不怎么样
人家用的瓦锡兰的柴油发电机组,单机功率才2MW,成熟的烂大街的东西。
我们不能为技术论,装备的成熟好用也是一种核心战斗力,所以还是应当谨慎看待电磁弹射,全电推进这些新技术的运用,不要整天哭着喊着002必须要电弹了,俗语说的好,步子大了容易扯着蛋
ruuyy 发表于 2016-1-29 18:54
人家用的瓦锡兰的柴油发电机组,单机功率才2MW,成熟的烂大街的东西。
瓦锡兰啊 惨了 又要怪中国货了
看了这个就知道为什么美国还计划建造老气的伯克级
gxyzya 发表于 2016-1-29 19:23
看了这个就知道为什么美国还计划建造老气的伯克级
AIM电机就是坑,我早就说过,串联越多问题越多
步子大了扯着蛋了!
新技术不成熟也算是正常。
幽冥虎 发表于 2016-1-29 19:30
新技术不成熟也算是正常。
正常啥呀,明知不成熟还用,就是不正常
没有先驱者尝试永远也成熟不了,英帝在航海方面的技术开创是要肯定的。
有一个方法英帝值得尝试,把技术卖给兔子,让兔子承担风险,还能赚上一笔,何乐而不为
aslash 发表于 2016-1-29 19:38
没有先驱者尝试永远也成熟不了,英帝在航海方面的技术开创是要肯定的。
有一个方法英帝值得尝试,把技术卖 ...
这个我赞成,我们为了牛牛的技术进步就吃一次亏吧
hase_back 发表于 2016-1-29 19:33
正常啥呀,明知不成熟还用,就是不正常
真逗。这么说,不正常的太多了。
牛牛很勇敢。
英国上某些不太成熟新技术也可以理解
他现在没啥威胁 不用时刻战备
舰队损失一点出勤率换取继续保持一流
的军事水准 这点亏吃的下
步子大了扯着蛋了!
哎哟喂,好形象的比喻←_←
这、这,如果消息可靠,妥妥的“体制”问题
探索的路上率先交点学费。未来会得到回报滴,因为他们的经验教训最多。
hase_back 发表于 2016-1-29 19:24
AIM电机就是坑,我早就说过,串联越多问题越多
这新闻倒没说电动机都出问题,主要都说是发电机的问题。
2016-1-29 21:14 上传

AIM电机就是坑,我早就说过,串联越多问题越多
人家说的是发电机问题多。
撒手锏 发表于 2016-1-29 21:03
探索的路上率先交点学费。未来会得到回报滴,因为他们的经验教训最多。
代价太大了,整个级六艘都面临一样的问题,影响所有勤务,而且困扰大半寿命周期。现在英国资源有限,这样的代价必须另他们三思。

就跟澳洲柯林斯潜艇一样,收获看似丰富但代价太大,就算有收获也因为造舰断档(为本国造六艘就没了)而流失,所以现在搞新潜艇(SEA1000)还是找货价产品。
mmx1234 发表于 2016-1-29 21:16
人家说的是发电机问题多。
电机既有电动机,也有发电机。但是AIM电机是什么?
aslash 发表于 2016-1-29 19:38
没有先驱者尝试永远也成熟不了,英帝在航海方面的技术开创是要肯定的。
有一个方法英帝值得尝试,把技术卖 ...
兔子会想买吗?不是说马院士正在研制的电推比牛牛的领先一代吗
这是在预言伊丽莎白女王级会成为港口皇后吗?
知道不成熟就要用最小的代价使之成熟。
比如加强陆地试验,造试验舰,不马上大批量。

现在6艘都造出来了,在结果还是不成熟,真够可以的。脑子有病才会故意这样干。
DJTesla 发表于 2016-1-29 18:43
牛牛的柴油机一直不怎么样
帕金斯还是很牛的,只是牛现在搞船用柴油机的功力退化了很多,就看现在还剩几成功力了。
早使用,早解决,真要等到别人都成熟了,自己才开始搞,然后慢慢成熟的时候,别人都第二代了,那才叫悲剧
海监84也是用全电推进,采用了ABB的AZIPOD技术,能实现原地打转的功能
不成熟的技术用在主力舰上也真是够可以的了,万一打起仗来,整个舰队都趴窝哭都来不及。
现在有点理解PLA为什么那么执着于过黄河水了,还是小步快跑比较靠谱。
ruuyy 发表于 2016-1-29 18:36
全电出问题换柴油发电机组?。。。柴油发电机应该是系统里最成熟的技术了。。。
推测全电系统出问题是用电超负荷,所以更换更大功率柴油发电机组。

但是问题的实质应当是由电脑控制的电力分配系统不完善导致。
onepiece 发表于 2016-1-29 21:17
代价太大了,整个级六艘都面临一样的问题,影响所有勤务,而且困扰大半寿命周期。现在英国资源有限,这样 ...
澳大利亚柯林斯AIP潜艇是二战后最失败的常规潜艇之一,

可以与之相提并论的唯有英国钓鱼加拿大的支持者级
技术上不成熟 研发不全面
唉?怎么会!不是看到有一大波人舔么?怎么会出问题?
核潜艇淘汰了算了
反正也用不上
钱可以用来多支撑几年
中国海军目前的自信很大程度上不是来源于战舰的性能而是中国军舰的可靠性,可以不在任何军事基地维护保养的情况下连续海外执行任务1年的时间,放眼全世界有几个国家能做到的?亚丁湾护航数个月之后不做维护保养随即转入全球航行任务。当一艘军舰没有了可靠性,不论再怎么先进也只是一堆只能宅在家里的废铁罢了。
如果是战时停电趴窝,我看看英吹们还怎么洗。
中国海军目前的自信很大程度上不是来源于战舰的性能而是中国军舰的可靠性,可以不在任何军事基地维护保养的 ...
已经有10MW和20MW电推,不过上军舰过于保守,大概会用推向市场的中压3MW电机。