英国太阳报:英国航母计画再砍

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英国再砍航母计画,F-35B减购86架,威尔斯亲王号降格为两栖突击舰

近年英国海军极力捍卫丶不惜删减Type-45驱逐舰与Astute潜舰来保障的CVF伊莉莎白级航母,这次无法全身而退了。由於F-35B已经涨价到每架9000万英镑丶未来超过一亿英镑只是时间问题,英国采购量从136架大砍为50架来节省至少76亿英镑;配合地,规划中的CVF二号舰威尔斯亲王号,降格为两栖突击舰(由於合约已经签署执行,已经无法将威尔斯亲王号砍掉了),舰上只搭载直升机,如此可省下6亿英镑,服役後取代现役的海洋号两栖突击舰。

所以将来伊莉莎白号进坞大修时,英国海军就没有航母可用,或许他们真该好好考虑法国人的提议,共同操作部署双方各自都「唯一」的那两艘航母。当然过去许多教训显示,英国跟法国这样的二流货色合作实在没啥好处。

在9月,英国海军也宣布将SSBN的阵容减少一艘,成为三艘。



The Sunday Times
October 25, 2009
Navy surrenders one new aircraft carrier in budget battle
Michael Smith

    * 3 Comments

Recommend?

The Royal Navy has agreed to sacrifice one of its two new aircraft carriers to save about £8.2 billion from the defence budget.

The admirals, who have battled for a decade to secure the two new 65,000-ton carriers, have been forced to back down because of the soaring cost of the American-produced Joint Strike Fighter (JSF) aircraft due to fly off them.

The move is a blow to the navy’s prestige and has come on the heels of Gordon Brown’s announcement last month that he was axing one of the navy’s four Trident nuclear deterrent submarines.

It is too late for the navy to renege on contracts to build the two carriers, the Queen Elizabeth, due to go into service in 2016, and the Prince of Wales, due to follow in 2018. Although the second carrier will be built, it will be used as an amphibious commando ship, with only helicopters on board instead of JSF aircraft.

The move will leave the navy without a carrier when the Queen Elizabeth goes into refit, leaving open the possibility that it might have to borrow one from the French navy. In a meeting with Brown last year, Nicolas Sarkozy, the French president, had suggested that refits of French and British aircraft carriers should be co-ordinated.

The decision to have only one new aircraft carrier will cut the number of JSFs to be flown by RAF squadrons from 138 to about 50, saving £7.6 billion. At current prices, the aircraft will cost close to £90m each, but this could rise to more than £100m.

Using the Prince of Wales as a commando ship will save a further £600m, the amount that would have been needed to replace the amphibious landing ship Ocean, which is due to go out of service in 2018.

The decision to cut the number of JSF aircraft has been agreed by senior navy and air force commanders in discussions preparing for the strategic defence review.

Both Labour and the Conservatives are committed to conducting a strategic defence review after the general election, which must be held by the late spring.

A senior Royal Navy officer said: “We always knew that the real cost of the carrier project is the JSF fleet to go on them. It would cost us at least £12 billion if we bought all the aircraft we originally asked for. We are waking up to the fact that all those planes are unaffordable. More than half of the £5 billion contracts to build the two new carriers have been contracted, so it is too late to get out of building the ships. This way at least we are covered when Ocean goes out of service.”

Since both aircraft carriers will still be built, there are unlikely to be job losses at the Rosyth ship yards, close to Brown’s constituency. The JSF aircraft are being built in Fort Worth, Texas, with the involvement of BAE Systems.

The RAF, which had been due to replace its Tornado aircraft with the JSF, will now equip all its frontline squadrons with Eurofighter aircraft instead.

The Conservatives said any decision to axe a carrier would be “absolutely unacceptable” and typical of the government’s “chaotic, inconsistent and incompetent defence procurement policy”.

Liam Fox, the shadow defence secretary, said the move exposed the government’s claim that it wanted a completely independent strategic defence review. “The government is saying it is fully committed to the carriers while at the same time forcing them to be cut,” he said.

“It is confusing for the navy, it is confusing for industry and it is completely inconsistent with the whole concept of running an independent defence review.”

The Ministry of Defence said Bob Ainsworth, the defence secretary, remained 100% committed to the carriers but “financial circumstances mean some difficult decisions will have to be taken to prioritise our forces’ efforts in Afghanistan”.

The Royal Navy currently has three smaller 20,600-ton carriers: Illustrious, Ark Royal and Invincible. Illustrious is on a visit to Liverpool. Invincible has already been mothballed.

英国再砍航母计画,F-35B减购86架,威尔斯亲王号降格为两栖突击舰

近年英国海军极力捍卫丶不惜删减Type-45驱逐舰与Astute潜舰来保障的CVF伊莉莎白级航母,这次无法全身而退了。由於F-35B已经涨价到每架9000万英镑丶未来超过一亿英镑只是时间问题,英国采购量从136架大砍为50架来节省至少76亿英镑;配合地,规划中的CVF二号舰威尔斯亲王号,降格为两栖突击舰(由於合约已经签署执行,已经无法将威尔斯亲王号砍掉了),舰上只搭载直升机,如此可省下6亿英镑,服役後取代现役的海洋号两栖突击舰。

所以将来伊莉莎白号进坞大修时,英国海军就没有航母可用,或许他们真该好好考虑法国人的提议,共同操作部署双方各自都「唯一」的那两艘航母。当然过去许多教训显示,英国跟法国这样的二流货色合作实在没啥好处。

在9月,英国海军也宣布将SSBN的阵容减少一艘,成为三艘。



The Sunday Times
October 25, 2009
Navy surrenders one new aircraft carrier in budget battle
Michael Smith

    * 3 Comments

Recommend?

The Royal Navy has agreed to sacrifice one of its two new aircraft carriers to save about £8.2 billion from the defence budget.

The admirals, who have battled for a decade to secure the two new 65,000-ton carriers, have been forced to back down because of the soaring cost of the American-produced Joint Strike Fighter (JSF) aircraft due to fly off them.

The move is a blow to the navy’s prestige and has come on the heels of Gordon Brown’s announcement last month that he was axing one of the navy’s four Trident nuclear deterrent submarines.

It is too late for the navy to renege on contracts to build the two carriers, the Queen Elizabeth, due to go into service in 2016, and the Prince of Wales, due to follow in 2018. Although the second carrier will be built, it will be used as an amphibious commando ship, with only helicopters on board instead of JSF aircraft.

The move will leave the navy without a carrier when the Queen Elizabeth goes into refit, leaving open the possibility that it might have to borrow one from the French navy. In a meeting with Brown last year, Nicolas Sarkozy, the French president, had suggested that refits of French and British aircraft carriers should be co-ordinated.

The decision to have only one new aircraft carrier will cut the number of JSFs to be flown by RAF squadrons from 138 to about 50, saving £7.6 billion. At current prices, the aircraft will cost close to £90m each, but this could rise to more than £100m.

Using the Prince of Wales as a commando ship will save a further £600m, the amount that would have been needed to replace the amphibious landing ship Ocean, which is due to go out of service in 2018.

The decision to cut the number of JSF aircraft has been agreed by senior navy and air force commanders in discussions preparing for the strategic defence review.

Both Labour and the Conservatives are committed to conducting a strategic defence review after the general election, which must be held by the late spring.

A senior Royal Navy officer said: “We always knew that the real cost of the carrier project is the JSF fleet to go on them. It would cost us at least £12 billion if we bought all the aircraft we originally asked for. We are waking up to the fact that all those planes are unaffordable. More than half of the £5 billion contracts to build the two new carriers have been contracted, so it is too late to get out of building the ships. This way at least we are covered when Ocean goes out of service.”

Since both aircraft carriers will still be built, there are unlikely to be job losses at the Rosyth ship yards, close to Brown’s constituency. The JSF aircraft are being built in Fort Worth, Texas, with the involvement of BAE Systems.

The RAF, which had been due to replace its Tornado aircraft with the JSF, will now equip all its frontline squadrons with Eurofighter aircraft instead.

The Conservatives said any decision to axe a carrier would be “absolutely unacceptable” and typical of the government’s “chaotic, inconsistent and incompetent defence procurement policy”.

Liam Fox, the shadow defence secretary, said the move exposed the government’s claim that it wanted a completely independent strategic defence review. “The government is saying it is fully committed to the carriers while at the same time forcing them to be cut,” he said.

“It is confusing for the navy, it is confusing for industry and it is completely inconsistent with the whole concept of running an independent defence review.”

The Ministry of Defence said Bob Ainsworth, the defence secretary, remained 100% committed to the carriers but “financial circumstances mean some difficult decisions will have to be taken to prioritise our forces’ efforts in Afghanistan”.

The Royal Navy currently has three smaller 20,600-ton carriers: Illustrious, Ark Royal and Invincible. Illustrious is on a visit to Liverpool. Invincible has already been mothballed.
与TG形成鲜明的对比:一个是想买东西,没钱;一个是有钱,买不到想要的东西!
日不落帝国成了日落帝国,活该啊。
都是缺钱闹的。
beck4587 发表于 2009-10-25 19:28

TG毕竟志在千里,另外外部环境也没英国那么好, 因此基本上航母不但要造,而且要完全利用国内技术造,一点不外购,而且船又比英国大,又是第一次造,耽误时间长点也是自然。
上面的战斗机不错
再苦不能苦了孩子,再穷不能不建海军啊……
是修改二号舰的设计方案了还是只是不搭载F35B了?如果是后者那就一套班子两舰轮着用呗,真有威胁的时候再配齐……不过看样子舰上设施甚至舰体也改了……
额, 太阳报,这个······
太阳报的“page 3”girls不错:page3.com :D


亲王降格了。。。。。 家长还是大啊。。。:D

船体结构动力基本面现在改来不及了 能把啥省略掉呢?
机库改部队住舱 说不定也不改啥大结构 原版机库航空分部再拆分空间 航空管制系统要简化不少

舰载机砍了
万一出来个二次布莱尔经济膨胀时代说不定还有救 不过至少要到第一次改造才有机会收拾家伙增强能力
到现在这个程度是能保的都保了 再保不住就要船台上开拆了

亲王降格了。。。。。 家长还是大啊。。。:D

船体结构动力基本面现在改来不及了 能把啥省略掉呢?
机库改部队住舱 说不定也不改啥大结构 原版机库航空分部再拆分空间 航空管制系统要简化不少

舰载机砍了
万一出来个二次布莱尔经济膨胀时代说不定还有救 不过至少要到第一次改造才有机会收拾家伙增强能力
到现在这个程度是能保的都保了 再保不住就要船台上开拆了
砍啊砍啊最后会不会砍成远洋补给舰~~??什么武装都不用,最省钱~~;
雪千寻 发表于 2009-10-25 19:50

帝国不在了!

钱啊,所谓英雄气短啊!

可叹,想当年.....
牛牛也在尝外购的苦果啊:MD一涨价,连造船的钱都没了……
太阳报的消息可靠吗?:dizzy:
英国才多大啊。。。。人口才多少啊。。。。。

早该面对现实了。。。。
英国的没钱,是在没需求下的没钱,看看其军费占GDP的比例就很清楚了。
有钱想、买不到是明着的

暗地里啥都能买到 人是活的 还能让一个死条约给憋死?
昨天才看的新闻,目前英国经济正经历着二战以来历时最长的衰退
地主家也没有余粮啊
不过英国海军的这个应对举措还是很有眼光的
飞机嘛,只要生产线没停,还可以续订,关键是把母舰先保住
至于弹道导弹核潜艇,这种终身不会真正使用的武器有一点摆摆样子就行了
有钱了可以再改
太浪费了 五万多吨的排水量做两栖攻击舰……再砍SSBN 那大不列颠的海基核力量就要不如TG了
顶雪版。。。

在歼星舰技术没成熟之前,空军水面移动机场还是最重要的。。。;P
英国人穷拉啊
悲剧啊
zhenyan 发表于 2009-10-25 20:43

改成兩棲突襲艦也是一樣的,未來只要有錢,然後美帝又跑去打某國,威爾斯一樣可以改裝成航母參戰,重點就是不能被砍!
雪千寻 发表于 2009-10-25 19:50

钱都给MSL小孩买奶粉了
可惜了大阴蒂国的那些技术啊!
TG要是能超底就好了~~~~
要是霉国变成这样才值得高兴呢。
revolutionzz 发表于 2009-10-25 21:12
别埋怨命不好了
tg抄毛子的底已经获利颇丰,该知足了,老想着再来一次抄底就是典型的投机主义了
14364310 发表于 2009-10-25 20:26
汗,连keely都上来了


自我吹捧一句:
我在2009-1-19在超大海军版发表的:
对英、印、法新航母的一些比较
http://bbs.cjdby.net/viewthread.php?tid=576558&highlight=
曾在第1、43、50、51楼探讨过英国只造1艘的可能性。并且认为:只造1艘,对英国来说也是可以接受的。

自我吹捧一句:
我在2009-1-19在超大海军版发表的:
对英、印、法新航母的一些比较
http://bbs.cjdby.net/viewthread.php?tid=576558&highlight=
曾在第1、43、50、51楼探讨过英国只造1艘的可能性。并且认为:只造1艘,对英国来说也是可以接受的。
太阳报啊 算了 我还是看看女郎吧
虽然最终建造1还是2艘,我说不准,但我觉得建1艘也不是不可接受。
英国只造一艘CVF有大问题吗?
个人认为有问题,但问题不大。
1、英国的海外干涉,多数是与美国联合行动,因此如果有时无航母出战,还可以依靠美国。
当然有时英国还要独立行动干涉动乱地区,就如前几年在塞内加尔那样。
在此情况下,有“海洋”舰(或其替代舰),有海外机场基地可借用,还有可空中加油的战斗机,个人认为还可应付一下。
2、少一艘航母,是否会影响舰载机部队训练?
当然会,不过F-35B是短距起飞垂直降落的,没有航母也能训练。
3、马岛倒是个问题,英国要独自应付。
不过这20多年阿根廷航空兵部队是不进反退,而英国即将服役的45舰,防空力量强大,足以应付这样的威胁。
4、还有英国舰艇(尤其是核潜艇)的对陆攻击能力也可弥补航母的暂时空缺。
5、CVF全电推进,在航率高,即使只有一艘,航母的空白期也不会太长。
其实……没有航母……也不是……不可以……接受;P
比较好奇改成两栖舰的威尔士亲王会是个什么规格的舰
有1艘航母,在绝大多数情况下能发挥较强海外军事影响力,但不能保证100%时间都能。
主要马甲 发表于 2009-10-25 22:56
英国海军跟议会玩游戏又不是一天两天了
主要马甲 发表于 2009-10-25 22:56
估计大概与美国未来两栖攻击舰类似。
也不见得完全不能兼容F-35,可能只是在这方面有所逊色。
rayghost 发表于 2009-10-25 19:56

有钱再买飞机。。