超级军网(转载翻译）阿尔乔莫夫斯克的乌克兰军人说：“波罗申科 ...
来源：百度文库 编辑：超级军网 时间：2024/04/25 02:24:11
http://novorossia.today/ukrainia ... oroshenko-is-lying/
据来自阿尔乔莫夫斯克的消息来源称：从德巴尔切夫包围圈的乌克兰士兵已经到达阿尔乔莫夫斯克，人数在1000人左右，其中有三分之一以上的的士兵受伤或患有战斗疲劳症，这些士兵正处于反叛的边缘。这些乌克兰士兵声称他们被出卖了，而波罗申科应当为这种背叛负责。
这场从包围圈里突围而出的悲剧是在这样一种情况下发生的：
2月17日，乌军第128喀尔巴阡山独立山地旅的旅长谢尔盖·夏珀塔罗上校以个人的名义与强攻德巴尔切夫的DPR和LPR的顿巴斯民兵部队的领导人展开谈判。谢尔盖·夏珀塔罗上校是被围乌军部队中军衔最高的军官，因为一周之前，乌军南方集团里的所有高层指挥员均已经逃出这个“不存在”的包围圈。根据士兵们的话，夏珀塔罗上校的谈判结果是乌克兰陆军第128旅可以携带轻武器乘卡车撤出包围圈。然后，在贯彻执行协议撤出部队的过程中，迫于基辅的压力，他试图随同撤出一个装甲车队。卡车车队带着大约一半的士兵自由地通过了撤出通道，而由装甲车辆组成的第二及第三车队被分离主义的部队打得粉身碎骨。
译注：文中“不存在”的包围圈，是指乌克兰总统波罗申科一直不承认德巴尔切夫包围圈已经形成。
显而易见，作为第128旅撤退的结果，DPR和LPR的部队要感谢乌克兰国防部的意见分歧，实际上已经完全抹去了德巴尔切夫包围圈，未经战斗就解决了一切。例如，在奥尔霍瓦茨卡（ Olkhovatka）这个地方，乌克兰军队遗弃了好几十辆装甲车和大量的火炮。根据已经撤到阿尔乔莫夫斯克乌军士兵作出的不同估计，在他们撤出后大约还有3000人依然遗留在包围圈里。大部分人可能已将向民兵武装投降。在向阿尔乔莫夫斯克撤退的过程中，大约还有300名第128旅及其他部队的士兵出于他们自己的意愿向DPR的部队投降。
撤出德巴尔切夫包围圈后现在驻扎在阿尔乔莫夫斯克的乌军战士的情绪十分低落，随着乌克兰总统彼得·波罗申科抵达阿尔乔莫夫斯克，以匆匆而来又匆匆而去的方式接见特遣队（就是那些不受阻碍就离开撤军车队的人），发表讲话表扬那些从“德巴尔切夫要塞”拯救出士兵的聪明的指挥员，这些士兵的情绪更加低落。
撤出的士兵把这个讲话看作一种模棱两可的说法，因为他们在过去两周的过程中已经被欺骗了。并没有告诉他们，他们已经被包围了，他们经受的食物短缺，他们几乎都被他们的所有指挥员所抛弃，而为了掩饰一切，在撤退的过程中，仅仅为了拯救波罗申科的形象，指挥员们轻率地违背与民兵武装达成的协议，以致造成了如此重大的损失。阿尔乔莫夫斯克的医院里满是伤兵，和他们一起到达的有约一百具尸体。谁也讲不清楚，在战场上还躺着多少战死的士兵。不同的数字估计在150人至1000人。
在乌克兰军人中谢苗·西蒙琴科成为最热门的人物，因为他作为“唯一能讲真话的人”，他说整个部队混乱而无组织、士气低落、他们公开地不听从他们的指挥员、当面诅咒他们。谣言正在传播，昨天在通往克拉马托尔斯克的路上逃兵向向好几个安全部门的官员开枪。
也许，这种情绪将成为终结这支有组织的乌克兰军队军队的开端。
记者：罗曼·涅斯捷连科，为“Zhurnalistskaya pravda”撰稿
译后语：也许这篇稿子说出了乌军从德巴尔切夫包围圈撤出的部分真相。在包围圈里的乌军指挥员与顿巴斯民兵达成只携带轻武器撤出的协议，而乌政府高层是知道这个撤军的过程的。因此波罗申科一直声称这是一场有计划的撤退。而执行途中，乌国防部有命令必须带着装甲部队一同撤出。最终导致后续的装甲部队全军覆没。按照文中说明的有一半的士兵随卡车撤出，按照乌政府军宣布有2500余人撤到阿尔乔莫夫斯克推算，被顿巴斯民兵武装围歼并俘虏三千人的估算也基本靠谱。
乌军的指挥系统犯了兵家之大忌，脱离了阵地，在行进中的部队是最容易受到打击的，特别是在没有空中保护的情况下。在阿尔乔莫夫斯克 - 德巴尔切夫公路受阻的情况下，乌军选择途径被民兵武装控制的303.1高地北侧的乡间道路撤退更是一个无奈而错误选择，道路泥泞、易受炮火打击成了乌军装甲部队最后的坟场。
--------------------------------------------
Ukrainian troopers in Artemovsk: “Poroshenko is lying!”
Ukrainian troopers in Artemovsk: “Poroshenko is lying!”
on: February 19, 2015
Our source in Artemovsk reports that the remnants of Ukrainian units having “broken through” from the Debaltsevo cauldron — there are about 1000 of them, more than one third of the troopers wounded and shell-shocked — are on the brink of rebellion. Ukrainian troopers claim that they had been betrayed, and Petro Poroshenko is personally responsible for this betrayal.
The tragedy of the “breakthrough” from the cauldron occurred under the following circumstances:
On February 17 the command of the 128th Transcarpathian independent mountain infantry division in the person of Colonel Sergey Shaptalo entered into negotiations with the commanders of storming Debaltsevo units of the DPR and LPR Army. At the moment Sergey Shaptalo was the most senior officer of Ukrainian Armed Forces in the cauldron, as all the top command of the sector “S” fled from the “non-existent” pocket a week before. According to the words of the troopers Shaptalo negotiated the exit of the 128th brigade in trucks with light firearms. However in the course of implementation of the agreement he tried, under the pressure of Kiev, to withdraw a convoy of armoured vehicles. It happened so that the staff column and approximately half of the personnel passed freely, and the second and the third convoys consisting of armoured vehicles, the separatists” crashed to pieces.
Notably, as a result of retreat of the 128th brigade, units of the DPR and LPR Armies thanks to the ensuing gap in Ukrainian defense had practically eliminated the Debaltsevo cauldron, having captured without fighting, for instance, locality of Olkhovatka, in which Ukrainian Army abandoned several dozens of armoured vehicles and a lot of artillery. According to different estimates made by the troopers that retreated to Artemovsk, after their retreat about 3000 men remained in the cauldron. Most probably they had already surrendered to militiamen. Also, in the process of the march on Artemovsk about 300 troopers from the 128th brigade and other units surrendered to the DPR Army on their own accord.
Spirit of the Ukrainian soldiers who had broken through from the cauldron and stationed in Artemovsk is very low, and it got still lower owing to the arrival of Petro Poroshenko in Artemovsk, who in rush-rush regime posed with the task force (those who left with the staff convoy unhindered) and made a speech praising the wise command who “saved” the people from the “Debaltsevo stronghold”.
The troopers took this speech as equivocal, because they had been lied to constantly in the course of the last two weeks: they were not told that they had been encircled, they experienced food shortages, they were abandoned by almost all their commanders, and, to crown it all, during the march out the commanders had bluntly violated the agreement with the militia for the sake of Poroshenko’s image, which led to heavy losses. Hospitals in Artemovsk are full of wounded soldiers, they brought with them about a hundred bodies, and no one knows how many dead troopers were left lying in the fields. Different figures are presented — from 150 to one thousand.
Semyon Semenchenko became the most popular figure among Ukrainian troopers, as he is “the only one who tells the truth”. On the whole the troops are disorganized and demoralized, they openly disobey their commanders and curs them in their face; the rumour is circulating about the deserters who shot several Security Service agents on the road to Kramatorsk yesterday.
Perhaps, such sentiments will become the beginning of the end of Ukrainian Armed Forces as an organized military force.
Roman Nesterenko for “Zhurnalistskaya pravda”
http://novorossia.today/ukrainia ... oroshenko-is-lying/
据来自阿尔乔莫夫斯克的消息来源称：从德巴尔切夫包围圈的乌克兰士兵已经到达阿尔乔莫夫斯克，人数在1000人左右，其中有三分之一以上的的士兵受伤或患有战斗疲劳症，这些士兵正处于反叛的边缘。这些乌克兰士兵声称他们被出卖了，而波罗申科应当为这种背叛负责。
这场从包围圈里突围而出的悲剧是在这样一种情况下发生的：
2月17日，乌军第128喀尔巴阡山独立山地旅的旅长谢尔盖·夏珀塔罗上校以个人的名义与强攻德巴尔切夫的DPR和LPR的顿巴斯民兵部队的领导人展开谈判。谢尔盖·夏珀塔罗上校是被围乌军部队中军衔最高的军官，因为一周之前，乌军南方集团里的所有高层指挥员均已经逃出这个“不存在”的包围圈。根据士兵们的话，夏珀塔罗上校的谈判结果是乌克兰陆军第128旅可以携带轻武器乘卡车撤出包围圈。然后，在贯彻执行协议撤出部队的过程中，迫于基辅的压力，他试图随同撤出一个装甲车队。卡车车队带着大约一半的士兵自由地通过了撤出通道，而由装甲车辆组成的第二及第三车队被分离主义的部队打得粉身碎骨。
译注：文中“不存在”的包围圈，是指乌克兰总统波罗申科一直不承认德巴尔切夫包围圈已经形成。
显而易见，作为第128旅撤退的结果，DPR和LPR的部队要感谢乌克兰国防部的意见分歧，实际上已经完全抹去了德巴尔切夫包围圈，未经战斗就解决了一切。例如，在奥尔霍瓦茨卡（ Olkhovatka）这个地方，乌克兰军队遗弃了好几十辆装甲车和大量的火炮。根据已经撤到阿尔乔莫夫斯克乌军士兵作出的不同估计，在他们撤出后大约还有3000人依然遗留在包围圈里。大部分人可能已将向民兵武装投降。在向阿尔乔莫夫斯克撤退的过程中，大约还有300名第128旅及其他部队的士兵出于他们自己的意愿向DPR的部队投降。
撤出德巴尔切夫包围圈后现在驻扎在阿尔乔莫夫斯克的乌军战士的情绪十分低落，随着乌克兰总统彼得·波罗申科抵达阿尔乔莫夫斯克，以匆匆而来又匆匆而去的方式接见特遣队（就是那些不受阻碍就离开撤军车队的人），发表讲话表扬那些从“德巴尔切夫要塞”拯救出士兵的聪明的指挥员，这些士兵的情绪更加低落。
撤出的士兵把这个讲话看作一种模棱两可的说法，因为他们在过去两周的过程中已经被欺骗了。并没有告诉他们，他们已经被包围了，他们经受的食物短缺，他们几乎都被他们的所有指挥员所抛弃，而为了掩饰一切，在撤退的过程中，仅仅为了拯救波罗申科的形象，指挥员们轻率地违背与民兵武装达成的协议，以致造成了如此重大的损失。阿尔乔莫夫斯克的医院里满是伤兵，和他们一起到达的有约一百具尸体。谁也讲不清楚，在战场上还躺着多少战死的士兵。不同的数字估计在150人至1000人。
在乌克兰军人中谢苗·西蒙琴科成为最热门的人物，因为他作为“唯一能讲真话的人”，他说整个部队混乱而无组织、士气低落、他们公开地不听从他们的指挥员、当面诅咒他们。谣言正在传播，昨天在通往克拉马托尔斯克的路上逃兵向向好几个安全部门的官员开枪。
也许，这种情绪将成为终结这支有组织的乌克兰军队军队的开端。
记者：罗曼·涅斯捷连科，为“Zhurnalistskaya pravda”撰稿
译后语：也许这篇稿子说出了乌军从德巴尔切夫包围圈撤出的部分真相。在包围圈里的乌军指挥员与顿巴斯民兵达成只携带轻武器撤出的协议，而乌政府高层是知道这个撤军的过程的。因此波罗申科一直声称这是一场有计划的撤退。而执行途中，乌国防部有命令必须带着装甲部队一同撤出。最终导致后续的装甲部队全军覆没。按照文中说明的有一半的士兵随卡车撤出，按照乌政府军宣布有2500余人撤到阿尔乔莫夫斯克推算，被顿巴斯民兵武装围歼并俘虏三千人的估算也基本靠谱。
乌军的指挥系统犯了兵家之大忌，脱离了阵地，在行进中的部队是最容易受到打击的，特别是在没有空中保护的情况下。在阿尔乔莫夫斯克 - 德巴尔切夫公路受阻的情况下，乌军选择途径被民兵武装控制的303.1高地北侧的乡间道路撤退更是一个无奈而错误选择，道路泥泞、易受炮火打击成了乌军装甲部队最后的坟场。
--------------------------------------------
Ukrainian troopers in Artemovsk: “Poroshenko is lying!”
Ukrainian troopers in Artemovsk: “Poroshenko is lying!”
on: February 19, 2015
Our source in Artemovsk reports that the remnants of Ukrainian units having “broken through” from the Debaltsevo cauldron — there are about 1000 of them, more than one third of the troopers wounded and shell-shocked — are on the brink of rebellion. Ukrainian troopers claim that they had been betrayed, and Petro Poroshenko is personally responsible for this betrayal.
The tragedy of the “breakthrough” from the cauldron occurred under the following circumstances:
On February 17 the command of the 128th Transcarpathian independent mountain infantry division in the person of Colonel Sergey Shaptalo entered into negotiations with the commanders of storming Debaltsevo units of the DPR and LPR Army. At the moment Sergey Shaptalo was the most senior officer of Ukrainian Armed Forces in the cauldron, as all the top command of the sector “S” fled from the “non-existent” pocket a week before. According to the words of the troopers Shaptalo negotiated the exit of the 128th brigade in trucks with light firearms. However in the course of implementation of the agreement he tried, under the pressure of Kiev, to withdraw a convoy of armoured vehicles. It happened so that the staff column and approximately half of the personnel passed freely, and the second and the third convoys consisting of armoured vehicles, the separatists” crashed to pieces.
Notably, as a result of retreat of the 128th brigade, units of the DPR and LPR Armies thanks to the ensuing gap in Ukrainian defense had practically eliminated the Debaltsevo cauldron, having captured without fighting, for instance, locality of Olkhovatka, in which Ukrainian Army abandoned several dozens of armoured vehicles and a lot of artillery. According to different estimates made by the troopers that retreated to Artemovsk, after their retreat about 3000 men remained in the cauldron. Most probably they had already surrendered to militiamen. Also, in the process of the march on Artemovsk about 300 troopers from the 128th brigade and other units surrendered to the DPR Army on their own accord.
Spirit of the Ukrainian soldiers who had broken through from the cauldron and stationed in Artemovsk is very low, and it got still lower owing to the arrival of Petro Poroshenko in Artemovsk, who in rush-rush regime posed with the task force (those who left with the staff convoy unhindered) and made a speech praising the wise command who “saved” the people from the “Debaltsevo stronghold”.
The troopers took this speech as equivocal, because they had been lied to constantly in the course of the last two weeks: they were not told that they had been encircled, they experienced food shortages, they were abandoned by almost all their commanders, and, to crown it all, during the march out the commanders had bluntly violated the agreement with the militia for the sake of Poroshenko’s image, which led to heavy losses. Hospitals in Artemovsk are full of wounded soldiers, they brought with them about a hundred bodies, and no one knows how many dead troopers were left lying in the fields. Different figures are presented — from 150 to one thousand.
Semyon Semenchenko became the most popular figure among Ukrainian troopers, as he is “the only one who tells the truth”. On the whole the troops are disorganized and demoralized, they openly disobey their commanders and curs them in their face; the rumour is circulating about the deserters who shot several Security Service agents on the road to Kramatorsk yesterday.
Perhaps, such sentiments will become the beginning of the end of Ukrainian Armed Forces as an organized military force.
Roman Nesterenko for “Zhurnalistskaya pravda”
http://www.nytimes.com/2015/02/20/world/europe/leaders-speak-by-
转载翻译--撤退士兵将战争混乱的回响带到了阿尔乔莫夫斯克
Retreating soldiers bring echoes of war's chaos to Ukrainian town
纽约时报2015年2月20日文章：
在被亲俄民兵武装包围后，乌克兰军队已开始从恶战后的战略要地德巴尔切夫撤退，Brendan Hoffman / 盖蒂图片社。
暴力持续困扰乌克兰东部，士气低落的乌克兰士兵踉踉跄跄地进入阿尔乔莫夫斯克市，他们在抨击这场从战略要地德巴尔切夫无计划的撤退时，对不称职的领导大发牢骚，诉说着绝望的战场情况以及可怕的杀戮。
当不少士兵开始酗酒的时候，市中心的广场上不时地响起了枪声。一位士兵站了起来在人行道上随风摇曳，嘴里喃喃自语。还有一些从德巴尔切夫数周的炮击下得以逃生的士兵强行乘坐出租车，又不肯付钱。现在还不清楚，是否已经给他们安排了睡觉的地方。有一队士兵默默地站在乌克兰大酒店外的街上，瑟瑟地发抖。
步履沉重的士兵闯进一家名叫巴布里奥斯的高档的餐厅，索要他们根本付不起钱的白兰地喝，在要求付账时，他们冲着天花板开枪，其他客人只得悄悄地离开。
包括海滨城市马里乌波尔郊外在内的整个地区炮击和战斗依然不断，周四，俄罗斯、乌克兰、德国、法国等四国领导人通了电话并重申他们对上周经谈判达成的停火的承诺。
这是一个困惑了他们好几个月的结果，甚至已经有超过五千人在这场冲突中被杀害。
根据20个由欧洲安全与合作组织（OSCE）派出的特别观察团给出的炮击和开火的报告，四国领导人，俄罗斯总统弗拉基米尔·普京、乌克兰总统彼得·波罗申科、德国总理安吉拉·默克尔以及法国总统弗朗索瓦·奥朗德，坚决认为停火依然有成功的机会，对此似乎非常乐观。
OSCE派驻乌克兰的执行监督任务的特别观察团发言人迈克尔·布休尔吉（Michael Bociurkiw）说：正在尽力有选择性的对停火进行观察，他批评分离主义武装阻碍观察员进入德巴尔切夫，他说由于德巴尔切夫已经遭受到数周的围困，有许多平民正陷入“非常可怕的状况之下”。
车上装载着战死乌军士兵的遗体。
Retreating soldiers bring echoes of war's chaos to Ukrainian town
New York Times | 20 二月, 2015 07:20
As violence continued to plague eastern Ukraine, demoralized Ukrainian soldiers straggled into the town of Artemivsk, griping about incompetent leadership and recounting desperate conditions and gruesome killing as they beat a haphazard retreat from the strategic town of Debaltseve.
Gunshots rang out on the central square, as many soldiers began drinking heavily. One soldier stood, swaying, on the sidewalk mumbling to himself. Others, who had escaped from Debaltseve after weeks of shelling, were seizing taxicabs without payment. It was not clear that all of them had been given places to sleep, and one group stood silently, shivering on a street outside the Hotel Ukraine.
At Biblios, an upscale restaurant, soldiers tramped about the dining room, ordering brandy that they could not afford, then firing shots into the ceiling as the paying guests quietly fled the premises.
With artillery bombardments and other fighting continuing across the region, including outside the coastal city of Mariupol, the leaders of Russia, Ukraine, Germany and France spoke by phone on Thursday, and reaffirmed their commitment to a cease-fire negotiated last week.
It is a goal that has eluded them for months, even as more than 5,000 people have been killed in the conflict.
The insistence by the four leaders - President Vladimir Putin of Russia, President Petro O. Poroshenko of Ukraine, President Fran?ois Hollande of France and Chancellor Angela Merkel of Germany - that the cease-fire still had a chance of succeeding seemed exceedingly optimistic given the reports of shelling and artillery fire relayed by 20 monitoring teams from the Organization for Security and Cooperation in Europe.
Michael Bociurkiw, a spokesman for the organization’s monitoring mission in Ukraine, said that the cease-fire was being observed selectively at best, and he criticized the separatist forces for blocking observers from Debaltseve, where he said many civilians were trapped “in dire conditions” after a weekslong siege.
There were also warnings that the separatists, having achieved victory in Debaltseve, would continue a push to seize more territory.
“The cease-fire has to be unconditional, there’s no exceptions,” Bociurkiw said at a news conference in Kiev, the Ukrainian capital. “As far as the special monitoring mission is concerned, we expect unfettered and safe and secure access.”
None of the provisions of the peace accord, forged during a marathon overnight negotiating session last week in Minsk, Belarus, have been accomplished according to the agreement’s terms and timeline.
There has been no halt in fighting. A Tuesday deadline for beginning the withdrawal of heavy weaponry came and went, with shells and rockets still falling. And there has been no apparent movement toward a release of prisoners.
Bociurkiw, at the news conference, said that the combatants were not entitled to pick and choose those provisions of the cease-fire accord they wished to fulfill.
“The Minsk ｄｏｃｕｍｅｎｔs are not a shopping list,” he said. “It’s one integrated whole.”
Bociurkiw also read from a statement by the chief of the monitoring mission, Ertugrul Apakan, a Turkish diplomat, who said he was “profoundly disturbed” by the events at Debaltseve, especially the civilian casualties.
Apakan also said he “condemned any attempts to create new facts on the ground and so to change the basis on which the latest package of Minsk measures were agreed on.”
The number of dead in and around Debaltseve was a politically charged subject, as was reflected in the widely differing estimates of that number: in the thousands, according to the pro-Russian separatists; at least 13 soldiers killed, 157 wounded, more than 90 captured and at least 82 missing, by the government’s preliminary count.
Witnesses said the number of dead would likely grow considerably.
In a statement defending his decision to order the withdrawal from Debaltseve, Poroshenko said that 2,475 soldiers had been safely pulled out, along with 200 military vehicles.
A spokesman for the Defense Ministry of the self-declared Donetsk People’s Republic, Eduard Basurin, said that separatist fighters had counted 57 bodies of Ukrainian soldiers on the ground in Debaltseve.
Speaking at a news conference in the eastern city of Donetsk, Basurin said that monitors from the OSCE would be allowed into Debaltseve on Saturday, once it was certain that there were no Ukrainian troops left.
Dmytro Tymchuk, a Ukrainian military officer and member of Parliament, said there were signs that separatist forces would try to seize additional territory. In a posting on Facebook, Tymchuk said it appeared the separatists were preparing to advance north from Debaltseve.
After the telephone call between the four leaders on Thursday, Poroshenko’s office said that he had told his counterparts, “Do not pretend that what happened in Debaltseve corresponds to the Minsk arrangements.”
His comments, however, only highlighted how Poroshenko and Putin have continued to view the conflict through vastly different lenses, and often with completely contradictory assessments of the facts on the ground.
The Kremlin, accused by the West of financing, arming, training and leading the rebel resistance, offered a positive assessment of recent days’ events.
“It was noted that the measures approved by the contact group in Minsk helped allow a reduction in the intensity of fighting in Donbass and reduced the number of civilian casualties,” the Kremlin said in a statement, using the shorthand term for Donetsk Basin, as the conflict zone in eastern Ukraine is commonly known.
The Kremlin said the leaders had agreed that the foreign ministers of the four countries would begin consultations “in the nearest future” about implementing the terms of the cease-fire - further indication of Russia’s view that the peace agreement remained on track. Germany also issued a generally positive statement.
“They agreed that for this it is necessary to take immediate concrete steps for the comprehensive implementation of the cease-fire and the withdrawal of heavy weapons under the monitoring of the OSCE,” the German government spokesman, Steffen Seibert, said in a statement.
In Washington, the State Department spokeswoman, Jen Psaki, offered a rather different assessment, in which she blamed Russia and the separatists for the breaches in the cease-fire.
“If Russia and the separatists it backs continue to flout the agreements they signed, it will result in more costs and further isolation,” Psaki said.
In Artemivsk, the toll of battle was on vivid display, as soldiers numbed themselves with drink, many standing on streets holding beer bottles and their rifles.
At one point, a tank was driving in circles on the city commons, Artemivsk Square.
“The guys are unwinding,” said one visibly drunk soldier, standing on a corner late at night, still in the muddy uniform he wore escaping from Debaltseve. “What do you expect after a battle?”
http://www.nytimes.com/2015/02/20/world/europe/leaders-speak-by-
转载翻译--撤退士兵将战争混乱的回响带到了阿尔乔莫夫斯克
Retreating soldiers bring echoes of war's chaos to Ukrainian town
纽约时报2015年2月20日文章：
在被亲俄民兵武装包围后，乌克兰军队已开始从恶战后的战略要地德巴尔切夫撤退，Brendan Hoffman / 盖蒂图片社。
暴力持续困扰乌克兰东部，士气低落的乌克兰士兵踉踉跄跄地进入阿尔乔莫夫斯克市，他们在抨击这场从战略要地德巴尔切夫无计划的撤退时，对不称职的领导大发牢骚，诉说着绝望的战场情况以及可怕的杀戮。
当不少士兵开始酗酒的时候，市中心的广场上不时地响起了枪声。一位士兵站了起来在人行道上随风摇曳，嘴里喃喃自语。还有一些从德巴尔切夫数周的炮击下得以逃生的士兵强行乘坐出租车，又不肯付钱。现在还不清楚，是否已经给他们安排了睡觉的地方。有一队士兵默默地站在乌克兰大酒店外的街上，瑟瑟地发抖。
步履沉重的士兵闯进一家名叫巴布里奥斯的高档的餐厅，索要他们根本付不起钱的白兰地喝，在要求付账时，他们冲着天花板开枪，其他客人只得悄悄地离开。
包括海滨城市马里乌波尔郊外在内的整个地区炮击和战斗依然不断，周四，俄罗斯、乌克兰、德国、法国等四国领导人通了电话并重申他们对上周经谈判达成的停火的承诺。
这是一个困惑了他们好几个月的结果，甚至已经有超过五千人在这场冲突中被杀害。
根据20个由欧洲安全与合作组织（OSCE）派出的特别观察团给出的炮击和开火的报告，四国领导人，俄罗斯总统弗拉基米尔·普京、乌克兰总统彼得·波罗申科、德国总理安吉拉·默克尔以及法国总统弗朗索瓦·奥朗德，坚决认为停火依然有成功的机会，对此似乎非常乐观。
OSCE派驻乌克兰的执行监督任务的特别观察团发言人迈克尔·布休尔吉（Michael Bociurkiw）说：正在尽力有选择性的对停火进行观察，他批评分离主义武装阻碍观察员进入德巴尔切夫，他说由于德巴尔切夫已经遭受到数周的围困，有许多平民正陷入“非常可怕的状况之下”。
车上装载着战死乌军士兵的遗体。
Retreating soldiers bring echoes of war's chaos to Ukrainian town
New York Times | 20 二月, 2015 07:20
As violence continued to plague eastern Ukraine, demoralized Ukrainian soldiers straggled into the town of Artemivsk, griping about incompetent leadership and recounting desperate conditions and gruesome killing as they beat a haphazard retreat from the strategic town of Debaltseve.
Gunshots rang out on the central square, as many soldiers began drinking heavily. One soldier stood, swaying, on the sidewalk mumbling to himself. Others, who had escaped from Debaltseve after weeks of shelling, were seizing taxicabs without payment. It was not clear that all of them had been given places to sleep, and one group stood silently, shivering on a street outside the Hotel Ukraine.
At Biblios, an upscale restaurant, soldiers tramped about the dining room, ordering brandy that they could not afford, then firing shots into the ceiling as the paying guests quietly fled the premises.
With artillery bombardments and other fighting continuing across the region, including outside the coastal city of Mariupol, the leaders of Russia, Ukraine, Germany and France spoke by phone on Thursday, and reaffirmed their commitment to a cease-fire negotiated last week.
It is a goal that has eluded them for months, even as more than 5,000 people have been killed in the conflict.
The insistence by the four leaders - President Vladimir Putin of Russia, President Petro O. Poroshenko of Ukraine, President Fran?ois Hollande of France and Chancellor Angela Merkel of Germany - that the cease-fire still had a chance of succeeding seemed exceedingly optimistic given the reports of shelling and artillery fire relayed by 20 monitoring teams from the Organization for Security and Cooperation in Europe.
Michael Bociurkiw, a spokesman for the organization’s monitoring mission in Ukraine, said that the cease-fire was being observed selectively at best, and he criticized the separatist forces for blocking observers from Debaltseve, where he said many civilians were trapped “in dire conditions” after a weekslong siege.
There were also warnings that the separatists, having achieved victory in Debaltseve, would continue a push to seize more territory.
“The cease-fire has to be unconditional, there’s no exceptions,” Bociurkiw said at a news conference in Kiev, the Ukrainian capital. “As far as the special monitoring mission is concerned, we expect unfettered and safe and secure access.”
None of the provisions of the peace accord, forged during a marathon overnight negotiating session last week in Minsk, Belarus, have been accomplished according to the agreement’s terms and timeline.
There has been no halt in fighting. A Tuesday deadline for beginning the withdrawal of heavy weaponry came and went, with shells and rockets still falling. And there has been no apparent movement toward a release of prisoners.
Bociurkiw, at the news conference, said that the combatants were not entitled to pick and choose those provisions of the cease-fire accord they wished to fulfill.
“The Minsk ｄｏｃｕｍｅｎｔs are not a shopping list,” he said. “It’s one integrated whole.”
Bociurkiw also read from a statement by the chief of the monitoring mission, Ertugrul Apakan, a Turkish diplomat, who said he was “profoundly disturbed” by the events at Debaltseve, especially the civilian casualties.
Apakan also said he “condemned any attempts to create new facts on the ground and so to change the basis on which the latest package of Minsk measures were agreed on.”
The number of dead in and around Debaltseve was a politically charged subject, as was reflected in the widely differing estimates of that number: in the thousands, according to the pro-Russian separatists; at least 13 soldiers killed, 157 wounded, more than 90 captured and at least 82 missing, by the government’s preliminary count.
Witnesses said the number of dead would likely grow considerably.
In a statement defending his decision to order the withdrawal from Debaltseve, Poroshenko said that 2,475 soldiers had been safely pulled out, along with 200 military vehicles.
A spokesman for the Defense Ministry of the self-declared Donetsk People’s Republic, Eduard Basurin, said that separatist fighters had counted 57 bodies of Ukrainian soldiers on the ground in Debaltseve.
Speaking at a news conference in the eastern city of Donetsk, Basurin said that monitors from the OSCE would be allowed into Debaltseve on Saturday, once it was certain that there were no Ukrainian troops left.
Dmytro Tymchuk, a Ukrainian military officer and member of Parliament, said there were signs that separatist forces would try to seize additional territory. In a posting on Facebook, Tymchuk said it appeared the separatists were preparing to advance north from Debaltseve.
After the telephone call between the four leaders on Thursday, Poroshenko’s office said that he had told his counterparts, “Do not pretend that what happened in Debaltseve corresponds to the Minsk arrangements.”
His comments, however, only highlighted how Poroshenko and Putin have continued to view the conflict through vastly different lenses, and often with completely contradictory assessments of the facts on the ground.
The Kremlin, accused by the West of financing, arming, training and leading the rebel resistance, offered a positive assessment of recent days’ events.
“It was noted that the measures approved by the contact group in Minsk helped allow a reduction in the intensity of fighting in Donbass and reduced the number of civilian casualties,” the Kremlin said in a statement, using the shorthand term for Donetsk Basin, as the conflict zone in eastern Ukraine is commonly known.
The Kremlin said the leaders had agreed that the foreign ministers of the four countries would begin consultations “in the nearest future” about implementing the terms of the cease-fire - further indication of Russia’s view that the peace agreement remained on track. Germany also issued a generally positive statement.
“They agreed that for this it is necessary to take immediate concrete steps for the comprehensive implementation of the cease-fire and the withdrawal of heavy weapons under the monitoring of the OSCE,” the German government spokesman, Steffen Seibert, said in a statement.
In Washington, the State Department spokeswoman, Jen Psaki, offered a rather different assessment, in which she blamed Russia and the separatists for the breaches in the cease-fire.
“If Russia and the separatists it backs continue to flout the agreements they signed, it will result in more costs and further isolation,” Psaki said.
In Artemivsk, the toll of battle was on vivid display, as soldiers numbed themselves with drink, many standing on streets holding beer bottles and their rifles.
At one point, a tank was driving in circles on the city commons, Artemivsk Square.
“The guys are unwinding,” said one visibly drunk soldier, standing on a corner late at night, still in the muddy uniform he wore escaping from Debaltseve. “What do you expect after a battle?”
原来是酱子啊。我说怎么打着打着突然就结束了呢。
为了菠萝的政治谎言，多少人白白丢了性命，无耻的西乌当局
原来这才是“自杀式撤退”的真相，我说嘛，军人不至于自己干这样作死的事
一将无能累死三军。
夏珀塔罗上校的谈判结果是乌克兰陆军第128旅可以携带轻武器乘卡车撤出包围圈。然后，在贯彻执行协议撤出部队的过程中，迫于基辅的压力，他试图随同撤出一个装甲车队。卡车车队带着大约一半的士兵自由地通过了撤出通道，而由装甲车辆组成的第二及第三车队被分离主义的部队打得粉身碎骨。
仅仅为了拯救波罗申科的形象，指挥员们轻率地违背与民兵武装达成的协议
士兵的生命不如政客的形象更重要。
仅仅为了拯救波罗申科的形象，指挥员们轻率地违背与民兵武装达成的协议
士兵的生命不如政客的形象更重要。
请问楼主主帖的链接
出自什么媒体，这媒体以往立场是什么
出自什么媒体，这媒体以往立场是什么
拿毫无保护的士兵的血肉去喂大炮，这也就只有常将军干过，在上海楞是把精锐德械喂日军的舰炮。。。。这样的部队能不败吗？以后伪军的兵会更难
请问楼主主帖的链接
出自什么媒体，这媒体以往立场是什么
一个博客，常年翻译各国媒体关于乌克兰战事的报道。。
地址？你让我发博客地址？
出自什么媒体，这媒体以往立场是什么
一个博客，常年翻译各国媒体关于乌克兰战事的报道。。
地址？你让我发博客地址？
夏珀塔罗上校的谈判结果是乌克兰陆军第128旅可以携带轻武器乘卡车撤出包围圈。然后，在贯彻执行协议撤出部 ...
西方体制不是宣传说可以有效制约选出来的领导人呢？怎么会这样阿，这十分的不科学！
西方体制不是宣传说可以有效制约选出来的领导人呢？怎么会这样阿，这十分的不科学！
让巧克力大王来指挥军队可真是个悲剧！
原来如此，西乌残兵败将能够保持活命最应多谢民兵的仁慈，在西鸟违反诺言下，民兵没有把他们全灭，三生有幸，按理民兵可把他们全灭也无可厚非。
这西乌政府也逗逼到极点了，以后部队更没士气了
夏珀塔罗上校的谈判结果是乌克兰陆军第128旅可以携带轻武器乘卡车撤出包围圈。然后，在贯彻执行协议撤出部 ...
西方式政治家的特点，说的比做的多，台上的圣女台下的婊子
西方式政治家的特点，说的比做的多，台上的圣女台下的婊子
能带轻武器乘卡车离开包围圈。。。。。民兵已经够仁慈的了。
我看很多乌克兰败兵撤下去的时候，连枪都没有了。
2485估 发表于 2015-2-23 18:43
请问楼主主帖的链接
出自什么媒体，这媒体以往立场是什么
我搜了下原文，第一个主贴是民兵自家网站
http://novorossia.today/ukrainia ... oroshenko-is-lying/
第二个是纽约时报
http://www.nytimes.com/2015/02/20/world/europe/leaders-speak-by-
请问楼主主帖的链接
出自什么媒体，这媒体以往立场是什么
我搜了下原文，第一个主贴是民兵自家网站
http://novorossia.today/ukrainia ... oroshenko-is-lying/
第二个是纽约时报
http://www.nytimes.com/2015/02/20/world/europe/leaders-speak-by-
阿宅发发发 发表于 2015-2-23 19:57
我看很多乌克兰败兵撤下去的时候，连枪都没有了。
逃跑时候，枪是最累赘的
我看很多乌克兰败兵撤下去的时候，连枪都没有了。
逃跑时候，枪是最累赘的
反正老美眼里西乌就是炮灰，只要能让毛子痛，西欧吃瘪，目的就达到了。
原子汉 发表于 2015-2-23 20:20
我搜了下原文，第一个主贴是民兵自家网站
http://novorossia.today/ukrainian-troopers-in-artemovsk-po ...
多谢
我搜了下原文，第一个主贴是民兵自家网站
http://novorossia.today/ukrainian-troopers-in-artemovsk-po ...
多谢顿涅茨克死亡公路的制造者就是这些无耻政客
乌现政府就是一群骗子
况复毛兵耐苦战，被驱不异犬与鸡。
看西媒报道，习惯性看最后一段的结论，总是在转进。
OSCE派驻乌克兰的执行监督任务的特别观察团发言人迈克尔·布休尔吉（Michael Bociurkiw）说：正在尽力有选择性的对停火进行观察，他批评分离主义武装阻碍观察员进入德巴尔切夫，他说由于德巴尔切夫已经遭受到数周的围困，有许多平民正陷入“非常可怕的状况之下”。
我就奇怪士兵们为什么不哗变？
夏珀塔罗上校的谈判结果是乌克兰陆军第128旅可以携带轻武器乘卡车撤出包围圈。然后，在贯彻执行协议撤出部 ...
打仗的毕竟还是士兵，而且这毕竟也还是一支军队，我觉得菠萝这是在逼炸营啊，白白找死连雇佣军都不干的，毕竟人家是图钱，不是来送死的。
打仗的毕竟还是士兵，而且这毕竟也还是一支军队，我觉得菠萝这是在逼炸营啊，白白找死连雇佣军都不干的，毕竟人家是图钱，不是来送死的。
死于政治家的算计、死于战友的误伤、死于停战钟声敲响前的最后一个子弹，有什么区别？
你是一名战士，怀着为祖国人民而战而牺牲的勇气，这就够了。
我不反俄，我反危害他国领土完整、民族尊严的霸权主义行径。
你是一名战士，怀着为祖国人民而战而牺牲的勇气，这就够了。
我不反俄，我反危害他国领土完整、民族尊严的霸权主义行径。
士兵们没有领到一份巧克力当作慰问品吗.也许乌克兰真的不适合作为一个国家存在下去.分成2半各过各的吧
死于政治家的算计、死于战友的误伤、死于停战钟声敲响前的最后一个子弹，有什么区别？
你是一名战士，怀 ...
对你说的话，真的无言以对！
你是一名战士，怀 ...
对你说的话，真的无言以对！
死于政治家的算计、死于战友的误伤、死于停战钟声敲响前的最后一个子弹，有什么区别？
你是一名战士，怀 ...
最根本一条,死的不是你
你是一名战士，怀 ...
最根本一条,死的不是你
为了菠萝的政治谎言，多少人白白丢了性命，无耻的西乌当局
好威支有！
美帝速度站出来“强迫”下，你所谓的某些国家。
或者赤膊上阵，直捣黄龙，各自取下普某或奥某项上人头。
终于尘归尘，土归土，王八对了乌龟！
你们身后有千千万万个观众，支持你们，干，英雄好汉，无需多言。
好威支有！
美帝速度站出来“强迫”下，你所谓的某些国家。
或者赤膊上阵，直捣黄龙，各自取下普某或奥某项上人头。
终于尘归尘，土归土，王八对了乌龟！
你们身后有千千万万个观众，支持你们，干，英雄好汉，无需多言。
无壳郎那些领导好像都是一帮美国国籍的吧，反正折腾完乌克兰，他们继续去当美国人了。
J11DS 发表于 2015-2-23 23:16
死于政治家的算计、死于战友的误伤、死于停战钟声敲响前的最后一个子弹，有什么区别？
你是一名战士，怀 ...
站着说话不腰疼，你去问问西乌的士兵答应吗
死于政治家的算计、死于战友的误伤、死于停战钟声敲响前的最后一个子弹，有什么区别？
你是一名战士，怀 ...
站着说话不腰疼，你去问问西乌的士兵答应吗
明珠国家的士兵怎么这样的素质？我们又没去当顾问。
J11DS 发表于 2015-2-23 23:16
死于政治家的算计、死于战友的误伤、死于停战钟声敲响前的最后一个子弹，有什么区别？
你是一名战士，怀 ...
在一个没有警察和法律的村子里，你家族一个邻居（也一大家子）要加入黑社会（而且这个黑社会一直准备侵吞你的家产），你的一个穷亲戚本来入赘他家（当时两家联姻对抗黑社会），现在不想跟着加入黑社会，正闹离婚呢——这种情况下，你是支持你邻居加入黑社会呢？还是想办法帮自己的亲戚？
死于政治家的算计、死于战友的误伤、死于停战钟声敲响前的最后一个子弹，有什么区别？
你是一名战士，怀 ...
在一个没有警察和法律的村子里，你家族一个邻居（也一大家子）要加入黑社会（而且这个黑社会一直准备侵吞你的家产），你的一个穷亲戚本来入赘他家（当时两家联姻对抗黑社会），现在不想跟着加入黑社会，正闹离婚呢——这种情况下，你是支持你邻居加入黑社会呢？还是想办法帮自己的亲戚？
死于政治家的算计、死于战友的误伤、死于停战钟声敲响前的最后一个子弹，有什么区别？
你是一名战士，怀 ...
怀着为国而战的勇气，被政客算计死？这还没区别？这是在为无耻波萝开脱罪责？
你是一名战士，怀 ...
怀着为国而战的勇气，被政客算计死？这还没区别？这是在为无耻波萝开脱罪责？
J11DS 发表于 2015-2-23 23:16
死于政治家的算计、死于战友的误伤、死于停战钟声敲响前的最后一个子弹，有什么区别？
你是一名战士，怀 ...
死于政治家的算计，和为国家作战什么的，能扯上半点儿关系吗？
还说不反俄，这完全是前后矛盾呐
死于政治家的算计、死于战友的误伤、死于停战钟声敲响前的最后一个子弹，有什么区别？
你是一名战士，怀 ...
死于政治家的算计，和为国家作战什么的，能扯上半点儿关系吗？
还说不反俄，这完全是前后矛盾呐
fattom2016 发表于 2015-2-24 03:14
好威支有！
美帝速度站出来“强迫”下，你所谓的某些国家。
要奥黑驴站出来和波罗见面，“王八对了乌龟”？？
——————人家又不是没有见过，不过奥黑驴更喜欢牙菜
还“好威支有”？？这不符合汉语语法哦
好威支有！
美帝速度站出来“强迫”下，你所谓的某些国家。
要奥黑驴站出来和波罗见面，“王八对了乌龟”？？
——————人家又不是没有见过，不过奥黑驴更喜欢牙菜
还“好威支有”？？这不符合汉语语法哦
风雨使者 发表于 2015-2-23 23:51
对你说的话，真的无言以对！
人家的意思是 为波罗而死， 乃炮灰之幸哦~~~
对你说的话，真的无言以对！
人家的意思是 为波罗而死， 乃炮灰之幸哦~~~